- Users of Google Chrome on Windows 10 and 11 are reporting that they have suddenly found themselves using Microsoft Edge, with their Chrome browsing sessions appearing in Edge.
- This may be due to a bug or an accidentally clicked-through dialog box related to a feature in Edge that imports browsing data from Chrome.
- The setting, called “Import browsing data from Chrome,” continually imports data from Chrome every time Edge is launched, unlike the one-time import offered for Firefox.
- There have been concerns about Microsoft’s tactics for pushing its own browser, including notifications, pop-ups, and full-screen messages promoting Edge and Bing.
- Microsoft has become more aggressive in pushing various subscriptions and features in recent years, making a “clean” Windows install feel less so.
- It remains unclear whether the Edge data-import issue is intentional or a bug, highlighting concerns about Microsoft’s methods for promoting its own software.
I think that governments should be tackling both Edge and Chrome at the same time. One of them for underhanded tactics, another for being a monopoly. Tackling only one of them is not enough.
I also think that Microsoft’s strategy is worse than just underhanded - it stinks stupidity from a distance. It’s clearly backfiring - this is not the first Browser Wars any more, people nowadays have a good grasp on what a browser is supposed to be. And while some pressure might convert a few users, too much pressure is bound to create resistance, even on users that would be otherwise inclined to follow you like cattle.
All the big tech firms do this shit all over the place because the regulators are sound asleep at the wheel.
Yup. In this case
- roach motel - it’s considerably easier to switch to Edge than from Edge
- appeal to emotion + appeal to authority + appeal to false authority* - “we recommend Edge, chrust us”
*those are technically fallacies. However, by trying to convince a user on irrational grounds to do something, they become a dark pattern.
Had to set up a new laptop for someone over the weekend and Jesus they just won’t stop begging you not to switch.
Search for another browser in the URL/search bar, gigantic banner that pushes the actual search results off the page: “There’s no need to switch browsers, Edge is safe, fast, etc etc etc”
Click the download button for Chrome’s installer, a pop-up notification shows up: “Edge is built on the same technology as Chrome, with the added trust and security of Microsoft” (fucking lol)
Go to switch the default browser in settings, another pop-up shows up again explaining that Edge is the greatest thing since sliced bread, I have to click either “Try Edge (recommended)” or “switch anyway”.
Then I spend 30 minutes navigating their maze of a settings app to change a bunch of ad preferences, etc.
Then I spend another 30 minutes editing registry entries to disable Cortana, Bing search in the search bar, recommended apps.
God damn I’m glad I switched to Linux.
And the same for a domain joined PC. Fresh install of Windows 11, open edge, find that you are already signed into edge on a Microsoft account that Windows helpfully created for you that mirrors your domain account.
You told edge that you do not want to transfer over your data. And it says okay but you’ll notice a little blue hyperlink that says manage above that.
And if you click that it tells you all the stuff it’s going to copy over anyway.
So you sign out of that and you untick all of the boxes and you close edge and you reopen it and you find that you are still signed in to your Microsoft account that was created for you with your domain credentials in Bing search and you have to sign out of that as well.
Edge has created an account for you, signed you in in two separate locations, and automatically set itself to ingest all of your account credentials and it does not even tell you what it has done unless you click through multiple paths to find it.
The game industry is going hard on “GaaS” or “Games as a Service.” Microsoft is going hard on “OS as a service” because, in the same way, they want your data or your money as you use the product
And if you need to use Microsoft Teams for work it will ignore your preferences and open links in edge by default, so you’ll have to find and disable that, too.
Just found this setting earlier in the day, before seeing your comment. That was annoying and such an unnecessary grab on Microsoft’s part.
And then once a quarter as part of their “feature update” they’ll ask if you’re suuuure you don’t want to change your default browser to Edge instead of your normal browser.
That’s awful.
…my mum’s laptop being unable to run W10/W11 was a blessing in disguise then. I’m glad that I don’t need to manage this sort of junk.
O&O ShutUp10 is free and handles all this automatically.
Regional settings > English UK
Bam, most of that shit is taken care of
Fallacies are called that because they are effective but not based in logic. They are the dark patterns of thought, rather than technology.
They are the dark patterns of thought, rather than technology.
That’s brilliant. Yes, it’s exactly this.
Here’s the summary for the wikipedia article you mentioned in your comment:
A dark pattern (also known as a “deceptive design pattern”) is “a user interface that has been carefully crafted to trick users into doing things, such as buying overpriced insurance with their purchase or signing up for recurring bills”. User experience designer Harry Brignull coined the neologism on 28 July 2010 with the registration of darkpatterns. org, a “pattern library with the specific goal of naming and shaming deceptive user interfaces”. In 2021 the Electronic Frontier Foundation and Consumer Reports created a tip line to collect information about dark patterns from the public.
Suggestion/request: please, consider making your bot opt-in, or to only act when explicitly requested to do so (e.g. by adding
!wikibotto the post/comment).While this bot outputs good info, and it’s trivial to opt out to a single bot, it’s still adding a bit of unnecessary noise, and a nasty precedent. Eventually Lemmy will get more bots, and some won’t be as useful as this one; the noise will quickly pile up, unless users are expected to opt out to every single one of them.
This would probably also allow you to let the bot operate outside this comm.
Yeah well I did this so that the bot just doesn’t sit idle waiting for someone to mention it because it’s not very well known yet. I might do that as it indeed seems like it’s annoying some users. Thanks for the suggestion.
Got it - for initial discoverability I guess that it’s fine.
I wish that we had some page or similar where people could actually look for bots, and how to trigger them.
Alright, thanks for your suggestion. The main program is not only now smaller but also faster. Anyone can use it anytime by writing their comment with their wikipedia link and mentioning the bot anywhere in the comment.
Test:
Read this to learn about computers: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Computer @[email protected]
Here’s the summary for the wikipedia article you mentioned in your comment:
A computer is a machine that can be programmed to carry out sequences of arithmetic or logical operations (computation) automatically. Modern digital electronic computers can perform generic sets of operations known as programs. These programs enable computers to perform a wide range of tasks. The term computer system may refer to a nominally complete computer that includes the hardware, operating system, software, and peripheral equipment needed and used for full operation; or to a group of computers that are linked and function together, such as a computer network or computer cluster. A broad range of industrial and consumer products use computers as control systems.
That’s great! Thank you for taking feedback into account; I genuinely can see myself using your bot in the future, it’s good stuff.
The regulators get more money the longer this goes on.
I was against all regulation and IP at some point, and yes, in such a situation MS would have much less power, because nobody would buy, say, Windows, only pirate it. Similar with many other products.
But the next best thing is to split and regulate the crap out of Apple, Google, MS etc.
But then the question arises:
When, say, regulators split AT&T, they did have some understanding of what they were doing.
Today all these companies are dealing in things which most lawmakers are unable to comprehend and won’t ever be able.
So maybe the way to deal with this all still is in aggressive action against IP laws, and not in anti-monopoly regulations, simply because there’s no way socially to make the majority of people - the pool from which lawmakers come - understand what exactly they are regulating.
This is exactly why regulatory agencies exist (as well as Chevron deference, something that the current Supreme Court might be about to do away with); so that the actual rules regarding specific industries are not created by politicians (or judges) who have no understanding of the subject.
The people making and enforcing most regulations are regular people working 40 hours a week in their field.
Maybe some are awake but corrupt.
I love how Outlook opens your links in Edge and gives you a little message about how it knows it’s not your default browser but it thought you’d like to open in Edge anyway.
I can always count on Microsoft to help me fix my default browser settings which I keep changing by accident. Silly me.
This has been annoying the shit out of me recently. I use several different computers so I keep running into this dumb shit. I feel like I’m in an endless fight to not use Edge. Microsoft knows I don’t want to use it but they keep shoving it in my face again and again regardless. I really wish regulators would step in and put a stop to this nonsense.
Gasslight Gateskeep Girlboss
They’re not going to step in to fix it. They have no justification for daring to stand up to a 3 trillion dollar company.
They might throw a 5 million fine at them or something, but nothing that’s actually going to stop this horrible anti-consumer monolith of practices
You don’t seem to be familiar with the history of browsers or the billion dollar fine Microsoft received in the 90s.
EU regulators can and will make Microsoft hurt if they want to.
Or this fine from 2013 which related to Microsoft breaching the settlement agreement from the first fine: https://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-fined-731m-by-eu-in-browser-choice-screw-up/
Same thing with MS Teams, except it didn’t give me any messages. It just started opening all my links on Edge overnight. I was very confused when I double checked my OS settings and Edge wasn’t my default browser. I had to manually set Teams to use the same as my OS default instead of Edge.
This whole thing reeks of higher execs pushing stuff no one wants or needs, while a poor dev has to implement shit like this and cry in bed at night.
Definitely had this happen. Edge imported all my plugins and tabs and started auto launching when I logged into windows. The auto launching made it obvious they were trying to confuse you into just picking up where you left off without hopefully noticing you weren’t actually in chrome anymore. Had been meaning to move to Firefox anyway, this just give me the kick I needed to do it asap.
Microsoft can pull the same trickery with Firefox users. It’s their OS, after all.
chrome and edge use chromium, so everything is 1:1 compatible. you can’t do the same with firefox: extensions work differently, several options will be different, any custom layouts will be missing so things look different, etc
they can just import bookmarks and open your last session’s tabs.
most extensions will be available too. they could check which ones you have in Firefox and install the ones available for Edge.
there would be some things missing, sure, but most people wouldn’t notice the difference immediately.
Then somebody should make an extension compatible with Firefox and Edge whose sole purpose is to close the browser if it’s running in Edge
If someone had made the active choice to use Firefox, I think they’d notice if it was replaced by Edge…
Seriously, this is a massive MASSIVE security violation. Trying to trick me into putting my passwords into your client instead of where I usually do? Lawsuit. Lawsuit now.
I didn’t even think of that point! That could have teeth in a lawsuit if someone had the time and funding. I’m sure there’s a lot of security and privacy related things with this bait and switch tactic that wouldn’t fly with courts.
It’s 2024 and yet, user programs can still steal data from each other. There should be some kind of permissions system in Windows, like in Android and additionally apps should ask if they can access data of other program.
I think there is, but 90% of windows apps resolve not to use that framework out of fear of the MS Store, even though you can theoretically install UWP apps outside of it.
the fact that a perms system is essentially opt-in for non UWP apps is laughable
I disagree. Back when Win32 was put together, these sorts of modern standards hadn’t been thought through by anyone yet. Even the internet wasn’t pervasive.
Windows finally decided “You know what, this API is ancient; let’s see what we can do to make it more secure and trustworthy.” That involves reorganizing the way these apps own files, make certain requests, etc. It meant it wouldn’t support the same stuff. But, by failing to claim any certain advantages aside from “safety FROM the apps you’re installing”, no one adopted it.
In fact they had been thought of, but few wanted to develop for it and nobody wanted to enforce it. Look at how old “capabilities” systems are.
It’s the eternal problem of not wanting to break backwards compatibility which I totally get from a dev perspective. From a user security standpoint though, it kinda defeats the purpose of even having the system these days if it’s so easy to circumvent.
It’s very easy to achieve that security as a user, in a non-circumventable way. Just refuse to install anything made as a Win32 executable.
You’ll be unable to do most of what people do daily, but you’ll be secure. And, Windows even offered that as a potential OS setup - and it was instantly seen as “Microsoft’s effort to lock down the operating system to only apps they approve”.
Users DID have that mindset shift once before. Back in Windows 2000, EVERY app worked off admin permissions. In Vista, everyone started getting annoying permission dialogs on their old apps to access admin folders - and just started accepting them. But now that most apps are correctly designed to access user folders, sudden admin dialogs are a big point of user suspicion. In some reality, we’d do the same with “…What? You want me to manually run a .exe file I’ve downloaded in the browser??”
I think locking apps to only their own files is a terrible idea.
If a program creates unencrypted, unsecured files on disk, those files should absolutely be free game for any other program. Because if they’re not supposed to be read, they should not be unsecured files on disk.
I’m decently sure that macOS already does something somewhat similar. If a program wants to access files outside its own directory, you get asked for explicit permission to do that.
If my hardware is to be used as a public space then I expect it to be provided for free. While I foot the cost, it’s my property solely, and encryption status of the contents remains completely irrelevant. You sound like you’ve drunk the corporate KoolAid.
Nothing you’re saying makes sense in the context of the comment you’re replying to.
The onus isn’t on the environment owner to lock down app space and secure data to the nth degree, it’s on developers not to ship poorly behaved apps. My files don’t exist in a public space like they are rubbish on a residential nature strip, free to be pilfered by randos. They aren’t free game in any way.
Conversely: as the owner of my device programs should not be creating files that I can’t access any way I want. My .rar files shouldn’t refuse to be opened by 7zip.
I should, however, be able to uninstall any program (such as Edge) that I don’t want on my system. That is what the bullshit originates from.
If there was a fiable framework for that in use by most applications, it’s fairly safe to say it would still have exceptions for the OS’s provided apps, “to improve the user experience”.
Ya say you want this. Use Windows in S mode and you have it.
I’d never heard of S mode until my aging mother needed to get on a Zoom call with her doctor, and I couldn’t install the app on her laptop because of it.
I set her up to use the web browser mode instead. Leaving it on was for the best at that point. I kinda figured S mode meant senior mode like for old people or something, idk. It certainly prevented her from installing anything bad by accident: and it was just a youtube and email thing for her anyway.
Yeah, you can only install from the MS store.
Install Linux and be done with this nonsense
I did. Now my internet doesn’t work. Problem solved 👍
…don’t forget needing to troubleshoot for 2 hours with forums and YouTube videos on how to launch any game that’s not steam / proton based.
Fuck those games. They have a license agreement with Microsoft and want you to be using their spyware.
So I shouldn’t be able to play any of my GOG games and write them off? Fuck outta here
As a steam deck user, (who is very familiar with Lutris) I am aware that Linux is not yet 100% foolproof for non proton games and downvoting users because you don’t like it just entrenches the stereotyped idea that Linux users are prude.
I’m not saying you should have to. You just gotta put up with the spyware that is Windows if you do. I’m saying that the companies who go out of their way to not work on Linux are bad companies.
Oh yeah for sure we all know the ones that purposely make changes to break steam deck like Ubisoft
Use Heroic for GOG/EGS. It also runs steam games if you want a unified experience.
I kinda like sometimes having to mess about. Beats having another browser annexing all of your data without consent or ads in your start menu. And the most important thing IMHO: it’s only ever going to get worse with windows, while Linux steadily improves.
On my work laptop, Teams has started to ignore my default browser settings. Firefox is still the default, and everywhere else links open there, but from Teams they open in edge anyway. Its really annoying
MSEdgeRedirect will fix that problem.
Oh sweet, the tool I knew that was similar to this got killed in Win 11 so it’s nice to see someone figured it out.
Yeah I’ve been using it in Win11 for over a year with no issues. It works perfectly for making sure everything always opens in Firefox (or whatever browser you use). Happy to help.
Outlook has been doing this for a long time too
Outlook is super buggy on FireFox for my phone. I found that Vivaldi has been running it fine enough though. It still fails to launch on first try from time to time, but I’ve never gotten frustrated enough to consider downloading the app.
Pretty much every Microsoft service does this. IIRC, it’s a large part of what landed them in court for an antitrust lawsuit in the EU a few months ago. Basically, another company (probably Google) was saying that Microsoft ignoring users’ default browser options and forcing their own services to open in Edge was anticompetitive. And I mean, they’re not wrong.
Same if you click any of the ChatGPT copilot shit baked into the start menu.
This makes some vague sense since the way its implemented copilot is pretty much served trough edge.
The whole start menu is pretty much a skin for edge that can also search local files.
It absolutely sux, definitely feels predatory as it basically includes a keylogger, everything you type is considered a bing search and collected.
Get linux when your tired of it.
Already on Pop_OS ;)
I have windows dual booted for a couple things I can’t live or do school without and don’t have viable options for Linux
I had same issue, some popup came up in teams I said ok to.
It switched my links to open in edge with teams pinned to the side. Very annoying
There is an option buried in teams settings somewhere that let’s you switch back to normal browser.
I’ve noticed that on my work laptop too. If I click a link in a Microsoft program, it doesn’t open in the default browser (Firefox of course), it opens edge.
But I’m doing anything important in a Linux VM anyway.
Teams has its own one-off setting buried in its own settings menu, I had to go intentionally update it there to fix it for me. Sketchy.
I had that experience a few updates back. But it eventually allowed to set a preferred browser again in addition to allowing opening office files in the desktop app.
Oh, that also happened to me at work!
When it first happened, a popup showed up at the right corner of Edge telling me about how it was improving my browsing experience or some bullshit, and at the there was a button to continue opening links in my default browser instead, clicked that once and it hasn’t pestered me again.
Unfortunately I don’t know if you can call this popup back if you accidentally dismiss it, though there might be a checkbox buried inside Teams or Edge to disable this behavior. Expect it to be called “Improve your browsing experience/Privacy” or some completely obtuse lie like that.CTT Windoes Utility -> Tweaks -> Remove Microsoft Edge
Removed edge when I got my new computer about a year ago and haven’t seen it since.
That almost sounds like group policy bullshit
Yeah, the Microsoft group
It sounds like they are actually using the PWA and don’t realize it’s Edge under the hood. They are mad Edge is opening links in Edge. Why would it do that?!?!
These AI generated article thumbnails are getting out of hand.
The thumbnail is from 2021, I believe it’s manually edited.
Reminds me of the creatures that russian man made with his own sperm.
Those are called children
He did what!?
https://www.elitereaders.com/russian-guy-injects-sperm-chicken-egg-attempt-create-homunculus/
Though many say it’s fake so yeah.
That’s staying blue
Many? It’s laughably fake.
Okay, let’s think about this for a minute - do chickens and human beings have genetics that are at all compatible with each other? (I’ll give you hint: chickens have a ZW chromosome sex determination system, humans XY). I’m not an expert on chickens, but I’m pretty sure the eggs are typically fertilized before the egg fully forms.
And then if we read the article:
In other words, it’s most likely the Russian guy was just entertaining everyone with his video. Whatever he did to make his “homunculus” appear alive worked on his target audience. It captured the overactive imagination of so many netizens. In this sense, his experiment succeeded.
Funny that it’s at the end, after a random bit about Paracelsus and a tangentially related real experimental process for making genetically modified chickens.
Let’s not take 2016 SEO clickbait garbage seriously :)
yeah it is fake, it’s obvious. It was somewhat disturbing when I first saw it though.
Windows problems 😄
Well both browsers suck balls, so there’s that.
The only way of interaction with edge I got is at my work computer which runs windows 10 😑 every time after an update the edge logo sits itself back into the taskbar until I remove it again. So annoying and and encroaching. For real fuck Microsoft.
That’s probably AD Group Policy on a work PC, but yeah
Afaik group policies ensure certain settings are set all the time. This really just happens after a windows update.
Nope, definitely not standard windows stuff.
L for using chrome honestly
Isn’t Microsoft Edge spyware though.
Would be difficult for it to be as much as chrome
It is worse, and Teams is even worse than Edge.
Just had to open a link in Teams and it ignored that Chrome was my default to launch Edge, then tried to set itself as the default for anything clicked in Teams.
I can easily see Microsoft doing something comparably shitty for people opening links in Word or PowerPoint. If not for Apple’s even more egregious ecosystem practices (among other things) I’d be very tempted to switch.
I am legally obligated to respond to your post to recommend Linux.
I already have tech tips, thanks tho
I had to deal with the same thing in outlook. A user was complaining that their password manager wasn’t working when opening links from outlook and didn’t even notice it was opening in edge instead of chrome.
Everything is spyware
Just tear off the cable cord of your PC FFS.
Adobe did something similar. It did an invisible update, but suddenly all downloaded PDFs open in acrobat, even if you have a different default app for that, and you have to dig into some obscure settings to make it fuck off.
“We hope you like the new reader layout” Really? I don’t remember asking you a goddamn thing.
Linux
Ketchup
No, mustard.
Mayo. Five of them.
Seven corndogs. No mustard. No mayo. Eat the stick too. You certainly will not regret eating seven corn dogs!
I’m just saying, I game on a Windows 10 machine, use Firefox for a browser, and have never ever had this problem.
Every once in a while after an update, it will give me the blue setup screen and try to set Edge as a default browser or get me to sign up for Office365 or some shit. I just click whatever tells it to fuck off and not install/sign me up for shit and never get bothered again until the next random update that makes the setup thing run.
But I can also see many users who are forced to use a setup they didn’t choose at work getting more issues than I would ever see because their setup is weird or their IT department sucks ass, or both.
